At this point, many, many, many progressives and moderates have seen Jon Stewart’s interview with Arkansas Attorney General Leslie Rutledge. Stewart does what I personally wish more people did: He challenges Rutledge’s misinformation and inaccuracies at every turn of the interview. When Rutledge tries to push back and say she (essentially) wasn’t prepared for the conversation, I think it reveals something very true about many folks who push anti-trans platforms. They don’t actually know what they’re talking about. Like, they literally don’t know.
Before we get into the clip itself, as some background, this interview happened in season two of Stewart’s show, The Problem with Jon Stewart. The first episode of season two is called “The War over Gender” and was released last week on Apple TV+. Stewart, who is cisgender, smoothly counters transphobia and fearmongering right in the moment, and in my opinion, is a great example of allyship and advocacy. An enormous number of people love this interview and Stewart’s overall approach here, so let’s break down the interview and why exactly it works below.
Who is Rutledge and why was this conversation valuable to have with her? As mentioned before, she’s the attorney general of Arkansas. Arkansas, as you might remember, was the first state to pass a ban on gender-affirming care for trans youth. A few states have followed suit, and a number of lawmakers are pushing similar bans across the country.
Whether the anti-trans bills seek to stop trans girls from playing in girls’ sports teams, accessing bathrooms and locker rooms, or from accessing safe, age-appropriate, gender-affirming health care, they’re discriminatory, harmful, and entirely unnecessary. They’re also rooted in bad-faith interpretations of current majority opinions in medicine.
At one point in the interview, Stewart does what I wish journalists did more of at the moment: He counters her claims about medical experts right at the moment. “Why would the state of Arkansas,” he says to Rutledge, “step in to override parents, physicians, psychiatrists, endocrinologists, who have developed guidelines? Why would you override those guidelines?”
Basically: How can at one moment the Republican Party be all about “parental consent” and “parents' rights” when it comes to what books young people are reading and sex education in public schools, but not when it comes to health care?
Rutledge tries to suggest that just as many experts and professionals disagree with those folks, trying to frame it as a disagreement where there are strong numbers on each side. In fact, major medical organizations including the American Medical Association (AMA), the American Academy of Pediatrics, and the Children’s Hospital Association (CHA) all consistently support trans-inclusive care for youth. Many have spoken out in opposition to Republican bans.
“But you know that’s not true,” Stewart continues, adding that she knows it’s not a one-for-one opposition.
Rutledge says, “Well, I don’t know that’s not true, I don’t know that. You know that.”
Stewart then asks why they would pass a law if she doesn’t know that that’s true. (If only we could ask every Republican this question ...)
Rutledge says they’ve had folks come to testify that 98% of people who live with gender dysphoria overcome it without these gender-affirming health care treatments. Stewart responds by saying that’s an “incredibly made-up figure.” Rutledge says she doesn’t have the name of the organization that backs anti-trans measures “off the top” of her head.
Stewart frames a hypothetical scenario of what would happen if an adult was seeking care for a child who had cancer. Rutledge says if the first physician they went to had a care plan she disagreed with, she’d get a second opinion. She then started to suggest getting a second opinion is what she wants parents of trans youth to do before these “irreversible” decisions … to which Stewart immediately points out that getting a second opinion is actually not what the law is allowing parents to do.
“The state’s not saying, ‘get another opinion,’” he says. “They’re saying you can’t.”
Rutledge countered by saying the cancer was “extreme,” to which Stewart points out that young people with gender dysphoria can quite literally die as a result of it and not getting the safe, age-appropriate, inclusive care they need and deserve.
Stewart later mocks Rutledge who insists on saying the state of Arkansas wants to protect children. “You’re making it sound like a nine-year-old walks into a doctor’s office and says, ‘Gimme some testosterone,’” Stewart says. “And the doctor goes, ‘Oh, thank God! Because we’re wanting to create an army of transgenders, because we’re crazy.’”
“We passed a law to protect the children of Arkansas,” she says.
“Again, the medical community disagrees with you,” says Stewart.
“Not all of the medical community.”
“Who doesn’t?”
“We’ve had experts testify here in Arkansas ...”
“Okay, from what medical organizations?”
“We have all of that in our briefs,” she says. “I apologize I wasn’t prepared to have a Supreme Court argument here in front of you,” she says.
Stewart is (obviously) a smart commentator and a much-loved comedian. In a lot of ways, he’s a great person to try and tackle anti-trans hysteria because so many Americans—including moderates and Democrats—love and respect him. He has the potential to sway people. How many Republicans or conservatives will be moved by a takedown like this, I don’t know.
In some ways, it’s fair to question if this segment isn’t just preaching to the choir, but from my years of covering trans issues even here at Daily Kos, I know firsthand that plenty of progressives and Democrats (unfortunately) do believe misinformation and right-wing talking points when it comes to this subject. So I do think Stewart’s approach here can legitimately change opinions for the better.
It’s also fair to point out that trans folks have made the same arguments Stewart makes. They’ve presented the same facts and basic points. And very often, they’re discounted as social justice warriors or extremists. It shouldn’t take a cis person covering trans issues to make other cis people learn and grow. And the same critique (fairly!) applies to my own role here, as a cis person covering trans issues. If I can educate people and change minds, that’s great for the cause. But if everyone just centered marginalized trans voices, to begin with, this beat of mine maybe wouldn’t even exist.
You can watch a six-minute clip of the episode, including the interview with Rutledge, above. The full episode is available for free on Apple TV+.
Republished with permission from Daily Kos.
